Outback RV Owners Forum: Outback RV Owners Forum -> Wolfwood's Wanderings

You'll just have to trust that the new axles are there too What we weren't expecting is that they flipped the axles when they put them on. Puff now sits WAYYYY off the ground, the side slide clears easily, AND draining the tanks should be MUCH more effective!! (I'll get pics of the new cloth, honey-combed, pull down/push up shades tomorrow)

5 new Towmaster Radials on shiny new aluminum alloy rims sitting in the bed of the Tundra waiting for delivery to the dealer in the morning .....


FRIDAY, 10/9 UPDATE: Tires & wheels deliered (Service guy says "ooooh. FANCY!" ) and axles are scheduled to arrive Monday)

Wednesday, 10/14 UPDATE: Dealer has confirmed that Puff is on the lift and axles are on (sort of). The axle work will be finished tomorrow and the new wheels/tires will be put on. She maybe ready to pick up tomorrow ... but since the hitch is in pieces in our garage, waiting for Kath to clean it up ... we'll probably not pick her up until this weekend. We are soooooo ready to have her home!!!

The Dealer has confirmed that the axles have been ordered and the 2 EZ Flex would be ordered as soon as we hung up the phone. Kath & I have finally ordered the tires and shiny new wheels. We ended up going with TowMaster Radials...based on your opinions on Outbackers and our tire-guy's advice. He didn't even skip a breath when we asked his recommendation re: TowMaster or Marathons!!! Ended up that we couldn't actually BUY Maxxis from anyone....although we saw LOTS of pretty pictures The final estimate for this most critical job is actually a whole lot better than we expected. (In order NOT to jinx anything ... we're NOT talking any real numbers here. Not now anyway...) Now - we just have to have all the pieces come together and the Dealer complete the install before the middle of Oct so we can make the New England Fall Rally.

We've also ordered new molding for both sides (yanno - that brown plastic stuff that trees eat off the lower outside edges.) and 2 new vent covers for the cargo bay. Our Dealer also got a PHENOMENAL price from Keystone for 5 pleated shades to finally replace those nasty metal ones. When they gave me the price - I thought it was for 1 + installation. Nope. She said it was for all 5 I'll let you all know if it really works out as quoted 'cuz - well - as I said - I thought she was telling me what just 1 shade would cost. Depending on timing (we've lost several weeks already), installation of these other components may have to wait until after the Fall Rally.

All in all, Puff will end up being an '08/'10 "hybrid" - - - with the axles, tires, & shade upgrades of the 2010 models and the queen bed & WHITE CABINETS of the '08. Oh - and Kathy reminds me that we also won't have to replace all the stickers on Puff's backside. Sounds to me like it'll be the best of both worlds!!!

This weekend's goal was to determine whether we 1) put the same axles on, call it good, & trade the TT or 2) hold onto our beloved Puff and invest in upgraded axles & 5 new Radials. It was clear that there was no future benefit to pursuing a claim against Keystone or Alco with respect to insufficient axles and we did confirm that there was a 1 YEAR (NOT a 2 year) warranty on the axles ... so we were a full year out of warranty, not the 4 days which had previously been reported by our Dealer. With this info, it was clear that there was no "fight" to fight....not credibly, anyway. We were then left only with the decision of whether to choose Door #1 (install the "standard axles" & trade...WE weren't going to "live with" deficient axles") or Door #2 (keep Puff and upgrade axles & tires).

We did a bit of research and found the 268RL - a model which we both like - alot - and can readily see residing at Wolfwood. We also now know that it would cost us considerably more to trade than to keep Puff and upgrade the axles, switch to the 6 lug Radial tires, add the EZ Flex, and do several other cosmetic repairs & upgrades that we've been putting off. We both had started to look forward to the benefits available with the new model year campers and looked forward to actually going down a bit in length but, once we had real numbers to work with, the choice was clear. We have a wonderful camper which we wouldn't otherwise have even considered replacing if it weren't for the situation with the axles and, if NOT getting a new camper is our biggest disappointment ... well, then, we figure we're doing pretty darn well. Sooo - bottom line - I will call the Dealer on Tuesday and have them order the Axle & Tire replacements so we can make it to the New England Rally at the end of Oct. Those few extra days we've booked after the Rally will, indeed, be that much sweeter!!! We'll then have the other work done during the winter. Let's just hope it all goes smoothly from here on out!!

Of course...if today's dealer REALLY wants to sell a TT...maybe he'll call and match our terms

As some of you may recall - - we took Puff to the hospital shortly after returning from our Canadian adventure. We were pretty certain there was something wrong, even though several "experts" had advised otherwise. Here's the Thread I posted about the matter....Bent Axle Thread

As this is showing signs of being more involved & convoluted than we had hoped, I decided to turn this into Blog Entries to make it easier to keep you updated. I don't know where this will lead us .... but you guys can come right along on the journey. Please feel free to offer any (constructive) suggestions you might have as you read .... we try to look at all possible corners, options, solutions, etc. but odds are - because WE are in the middle of this - we may miss something that someone looking in from the outside may see. Sooooooo - here we go.......

Dealer's Estimate to Repair =
a. Replacement Axles (as is) = $950.00 installed
b. Next heavier axles require 6-lug tires (our's are 5-lugs) = $2,131 installed (heavier axles & six 6-lug radial tires)
c. EZ Flex = $450 installed

Warranty: Seems the Warranty Card was filed with Keystone on Aug.25, 2007 ... so the axle manuf. 2yr warranty was expired - by 4 DAYS - when the TT was delivered to the dealer on Aug. 29, 2009. Now, there is still some question here. Seems the Warranty Card received by Keystone triggered the warranty to begin Aug 25, 2007 ... but our insurance policy shows we purchased it on Sept.1st. Somebody's date is wrong but OUR records are currently locked in the TT at the Dealer. We'll get them tomorrow and resolve whether this is actually a manufacturer's warranty claim or not.

Extended Warranty specifically excludes axles.

Insurance: If there is no Warranty coverage, then this becomes an insurance claim - which I filed last week. The Claims Adjuster saw the TT today and called me from the Dealer's shop.

He agrees that the axles are bent, has no issue with Dealer's estimate, and said it was borderline whether this should even be covered by insurance as (as per the Service Tech) its a result of the TT manufacturer not using what they should have (heavier axles). BUT, as stated by the Adj., "the insurance company doesn't get involved in that discussion with manufacturers and won't pay for more than what we had on there to begin with." He has agreed to cut us a check tonight for the value of the estimate to replace the bent axles with axles of the same weight less our deductible ($950est. - $500ded. = $450).

The next step, he says, is up to us. His statement (repeatedly ) was that he'd put the heavier axles on it or get rid of it .... BUT he doesn't have to come up with the $$$. Of course our preference is the heavier axles but the $500 deductible is already beyond "budget". Whether we replace the bent axles with the same product, or come up with the $$$ somewhere to put the heavier axles & tires on, Insurance will only pay $450....coincidentally, the cost of the EZ Flex installed - so we're looking at a bill of either $950 or $2,131 and either one hurts .... ALOT!

Now...Kathy has done some digging and has come up with the following info. The TT's GVWR (per the Dealer's documentation) = 7,550. This is important and may be key!! If the TT GVWR was 7,550, why was only 7,000 lbs of axles put on the TT? The Dealer's tech agrees. Kath has gathered the specs for all Outbacks from 2008 to 2010 and they have gone from putting 14” wheels on ALL the Outback TTs in 2008 to starting to put 15” wheels on ALL Outbacks in 2009 (completing this by 2010). Presumably, this means they went from 3500lb axles to at least 4,000lb axles. As stated, they started this for the 2009MY, but by 2010, they’re ALL that way, even the 21' Outbacks. Perhaps a cogent argument could be made to Keystone to cover at least half the axles and tire replacement cost, since we’ve already been through a set and a half of tires.

Also, Keystone has had a little problem with putting either the wrong Gross Axle weight or tire inflation rate sticker on some Passports, Springdale, Clearwater, and Summerland trailers. There are 5 National Highway Transportation Safety Administration cases out on this subject (involving Keystone). In a 2008 Passport incident, the axles were labeled 4400#, instead of their actual capacity of 3500#.

Sooooo....

1) At our reported GVWR of 7550lbs, our 3500lb axles were undersized to begin with
2) Keystone upgraded the axles on trailers that weigh the same or less than ours (ex. 210RS, 230RS,and 250RS)
3) There’s been an issue with incorrect labeling – what else was labeled incorrectly?
4) We may contact NHTSA to see if there is an undersized axle issue in Outbacks. How many are represented here on Outbackers? We sure could use that info


The 2009 New England Fall Rally is Oct. 23 - 25, and we have booked into the CG for that and a few extra days (Oct.23-28). We can certainly make the Rally & week of camping if we simply take the Insurance money & apply it to "replacement axles". That option would "make us whole" but it would seem that what we started with originally WASN'T what it should have been .... and that sounds like a safety issue. Alternatively, we can pursue the options of investigating numbers and dates and wrangling with TT and axle manufacturers to try to get someone to pay for the axles that it looks like should have been put on the TT to begin with (and replace the 5-lug tires that we did buy with the 6-lug tires that we would have bought). I expect we will be doing the latter as it would appear that the 3500lb axles were inadequate then ... so they would certainly still be inadequate now.

'Twas the night before departure
And all thru the Trailer
All creatures were scrambling
To ensure no failure
Of tires or power or mapping or such
'cuz 2 campers are packed...with maybe too much!!

We did, in fact, leave Fremont at about 6:00am on Friday and made it to Peterborough about 6:30pm. The drive was great - albeit wet - but as we approached the border, we could see that the sun was shining "over there". And there it was - glowing like a beacon of hope - calling to me in the low, soft voice of the seductive siren .... the glowing red sign of Tim Horton's!!!! As we pulled off the exit and sat at the light, waiting to turn right onto the last leg of this part of the journey, there sat Tim Horton's just off to the right, beckoning to Judi. "I'm gonna turn in there" declared Judi - - "No you're not" replied Kathy ... "We're almost there and Steve will go get you one". I don't know what I was thinking...after all, I was driving....I was in control - - RIGHT? (Yeah, right. Think again ) On past Tim Horton's we drove... (And no, I didn't get any that day...but Kath did go out yesterday and returned with a wonderful Iced Cappucchino to which such Amaretto was added .... and we all lived happily ever after

We've had 2 wonderful "down days" here in Peterborough, sitting by or swimming in the pool, enjoying each others' company, while the dogs play and get to know each other. Ruth did the "big" grocery run today, followed by a fair amount of time prepping & wrapping food for the freezer - while Steve installed a back-up camera on his camper and got various other pieces & parts ready for the journey. A special thanks to these 2 - who have welcomed the dogs with open arms, prepared wonderful dinners for us (and haven't permitted us to do much to help) and, generally, opened their home to us for 3 days (not planned that way).

Most of the time - THIS would have been the "vacation". After all - it was a 12hr drive to get here and Steve/Ruth have spoiled us rotten as the "kids" have had a great time together and we have enjoyed the pool (and, YES, the sun!!!) But - hey!! - we've only just begun. The plan is to pull out by 10:00am tomorrow and head ~6hrs north to Chutes PP in Massey, Ont. where the bigger adventure begins!!

....and WE'RE OFF!!!!

Clothes packed ....
Human food packed ....
Dog food packed ....
Dog toys packed ....
Human toys packed ....
Propane filled ....
(Some) water filled ....
M-A-P-S ready ....
Canada insurance card, dog records, & passports in the truck ....
Camera cleaned & ready ....
Truck cleaned ....
Truck gassed up ....
Tires checked ....
TPMS installed ....
Telescope secured ....

Looks like we're READY!!!! Time to go to bed so we can get up at 3 and be on the road by 4.

ON YOUR MARK .... GET SET ....

WE'RE GONE!!!!

Having never 'blogged' before, I really have no idea what I'm doing or how this will turn out. BUT, we are getting ready to leave for our 2nd "Adventure of a Lifetime" (the 1st having been our sojourn to Africa)....during which we will be checking several things off our Bucket Lists!!! We've been planning this trip for more than a year and it's taken on a few different forms in that time, finally settling on a moving trip. What's that mean? Wolfwood (Kathy, I, & 3 Shelties) will be leaving NH, USA at Odark:30 this Friday morning and heading to Peterborough, ON, Canada where we will meet up with NorthernWind (Steve, Ruth, & 2 Collies). The 4 of us will do a collective grocery/beer/Tim's Coffee run the next day, sort out any duplicate gear that we don't really need to have with us, and spend the rest of the time just relaxing and letting the 5 dogs become acquainted. We will, after all, be traveling for 2 weeks with 2 18m/o collies & a 2y/o, an 8y/o, and an 11y/o Sheltie. Three of them have met (and collectively have a GREAT time together) but NorthernWind has a new boy and we have a new girl ... should be fun (!!!). Kathy & I are already geared up for 2 weeks of hearing "Oh, how cute. They must be the babies!" WRONG!! What most people don't realize is that Collies are just over-grown Sheltie Wanna-Bs. But - not to worry....Seeker will have the entire pack in-line in no time!!!

This journey was originally planned as a week at ThunderBay (at the top of THE lake) followed by a week at Algonquin (off to the East) ... but reservations were scarce and our imaginations got the best of us.....soooooo..... pull out a map of Ontario, Canada and travel along with us!!! <You do remember what a "M-A-P is, right?>

2 Outbacks, 4 Humans, & 5 dogs pull out of Peterborough, ON on Sunday and head West to the Barre, ON area to spend the day with Ruth's parents and at least 1 cousin. Kathy & I met them all this past Fall at NorthernWind's daughter's wedding and we're really looking forward to seeing them all again!! Judi & Mike will definitely be lost to the cameras!! From there, we head North on the ONLY road around THE lake, stopping at several of ON's beautiful Provincial Parks ... kind of like a series of back-to-back weekends with some rather spectacular stuff packed in in-between!! We will spend time in Thunder Bay & Algonquin PParks and, on 8/10, the campers stay put at Cochrane, the dogs go to a kennel, & the humans take the 5hr PolarBear Express train waaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyy NORTH to Moosenee, spend the night at the Cree Indian Village in James Bay, ON, and fish & swim in ... okay, maybe just TOUCH ... Hudson Bay - the southern tip of the Arctic Ocean I'm also told - weather permitting - that there's a REALLY good chance (every night) that we'll see the Northern Lights!!! The auroras have been pretty quiet this year but there has been some recent activity AND we will be there at the time of year when activity normally picks up ... so keep your fingers & toes crossed for us!!! And...YES....the camera is primed, packed, & ready!!!!

OK...enough babbling ... I mean ... blogging for today. Gotta go pack a camper!! Here's the itinerary for those of you who want to know ....

8/3: Chutes Provincial Park, Massey On.
8/5: Pancake Bay P.P. Batchawana Bay On.
8/7: Rainbow Falls P.P. Rossport On.
8/9: Greenwater P.P. near Cochrane On.
8/12: Finaylyson Point, Temagami On.
8/14: Lake St. Peter P.P. (just outside Algonquin P.P.)
8/16: Peterborough, On.

ON YOUR MARK .... GET SET ....